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Tim Cain Interview: Game development changes over the past 3 decades, his role at Obsidian, and the future of RPGs and Fallout
Following in the footsteps of recent interviews with Joshua Sawyer, Chris Avellone, and Jason Bergman, I was lucky enough to have the privilege of interviewing the father of Fallout himself, Tim Cain.
(Full interview available either at Gamasutra or willooi blog
[His new role at Obsidian]
I really enjoy working at Obsidian. I know many of the people there from our time at Interplay or Troika, and I have played all of Obsidian's games, so in many ways this new job was the smoothest transition I have ever made. Everyone there has been very friendly and welcoming, and I am excited to be back in the RPG game space.
But I should explain that I am a temporary contracted employee at Obsidian. I am considering joining another company in the spring of 2012 and have been talking with them since August, so in the meantime I am working at Obsidian on one of their games as a senior programmer. My contract extends thru March of 2012, at which time all parties (myself, Obsidian and the other company) can decide what the next step should be.
As a senior programmer, I have been assigned to work for Dan Spitzley on their New York project. I am working on various coding tasks concerning combat and general gameplay. The group is very open to design suggestions from all of its members, and they hold weekly meetings where the game is played and anyone can suggest changes to gameplay, anything from new abilities to UI to voice over. Everyone at Obsidian is very passionate about their games, and it shows in their development process.
[How the industry has changed over the years]
I started in the game industry in 1981, while I was still in high school. I made an editor for a local company making games played on cable boxes, and that turned into a full-time programming job on Grand Slam Bridge, released by Electronic Arts in 1986. So this year marks my 30th anniversary in the industry. And I still have no idea where we are headed.
The rise of smartphones and social media has introduced a whole new group of people to playing games. These casual games are driving the industry as much as the hardcore segment, so my best guess is that over the next few years we will see the industry schism into two big development types, small developers who make several small games a year on tiny budgets and big developers who take years to make a game with budgets of 50 or 100 million dollars. The big question is what will happen to mid-tier developers, the ones who used to make all of the games we grew up on. Can they compete with the other groups or will they morph into being one or the other? Only time will tell.
[What makes an RPG an RPG]
I think an RPG should be about creating and playing a "role". First, an RPG should always include some kind of character creation system, to let the player choose what kind of character to play, and I prefer that the game let me name my character, although I can see why some games don't allow that so that they can include voice overs that talk about the character.
Second, I think RPG's should be about choice, and that choice should matter in some way. The player should be able to decide how to play their character and the game should react to that choice in some way. NPC's should change their behavior, or vendors should change their prices, or the storyline should change and the game should offer a different ending.
I play a large variety of games, not just RPG's, so I enjoy many of the action titles that are released. I think that including RPG-like systems improves many of these games, but there will always be a soft spot in my heart for true RPG's.
[What he thought of New Vegas]
I really liked Fallout: New Vegas. I thought it was the most Fallout-y of the post-original games, especially humor-wise, and I think the designers at Obsidian really understand and respect the franchise. And I do like how the game has been extended in many ways, into 3D play, into real-time combat, and into new areas of the world. These extensions enrich the IP and bring it to a new audience of gamers.
[The future of the franchise]
I think there are lots of areas in the Fallout IP that are ripe for exploring. And I don't think that people should be afraid that such exploration will make for a lesser Fallout. Expanding the IP is always a good thing, as long as its nature stays true to the original. That nature consists of exploration (both of the exterior world and one's inner self), of examining gray areas (because what important ideas are truly black and white), and of finding humor in the darkest situations.
I mentioned in a recent interview that I am for the repealing of copyright extensions. I feel that 28 years is more than enough time for a creator to make money off of his creation. After that, I want people to be encouraged to explore the works of other artists and to try to extend them in ways their original creator never imagined. There is a risk that horrible products will be generated, but that's a risk we should take to allow the occasional diamond in the rough to shine through.
[Pets]
My twenty-year old dog Cooter, who I picked up at a shelter when he was nine, passed away a few months ago. He was very well-behaved and was at Troika for the development and shipping of all three of our games. He will be missed. I have a cat, a tabby named Bonkers. I treat her like a dog and taught her to fetch and to come when I call her. She tolerates me.
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286 comments
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OH MY GOD A CAT NAMED BONKERS. JESUS, THIS IS STRANGE, CAUSE CATS ARE MY FAV ANIMAL!
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On Bethesda's Fallout 3:
He enjoyed playing the game, but was critical about the humor and the reuse of too many story elements from the earlier Fallout's which he would have done differently. He lauded the adaptation of "S. P. E. C. I. A. L." system into a FPS-RPG and their understanding of the lore of the game
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Glad Cain realizes/agrees with the rehashing bit. I'm surprised he didn't criticize the canonical inconsistencies or that SPECIAL was pretty streamlined
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What does he mean the humor? Does he mean there was too much? Not enough? Because in my opinion the game could use just a bit more humor. Thought i agree with the re-usage but it wasnt too much in my opinion. Actually for the first half of the game with the super mutant BoS war ,Vault exile First time in the wastes, Vault never opens or never closes.Yeah that was too much but after that it got better.
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It was the entire second act. Stop the super mutants from making more of themselves (Fallout 1), find the GECK and stop the Enclave from killing everyone with a modified strain of FEV (Fallout 2). It was WAY too much. The first act was alright
It also wasn't the amount of humor so much as what type
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Whether it was "WAY" to much or not is an opinion. They were introducing the franchise to a much wider audience and wanted to incorporate some of the major elements from past Fallouts.
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I read the 'lauded' as 'laughed at'. Seems more true that way.
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@ GhostPerson And? Doesn't mean that they had to do it in an inconsistent manner. They also could've introduced new factions and covered the major themes
@ YakovFrolov Me too
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@maulYoda please, explain these inconsistencies. Show me them. Tell me where they are.
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@ Anon
It takes a while to explain a lot of them in-depth (I could message you if you want), but on a general level, the appearance of the Enclave made no sense, Vault 87 and the super mutants had a number of inconsistencies that questioned their existence, the BOS's drastic change in behavior, the appearance of Harold, some of the aesthetic alterations to the weapons and creatures, the state the world was in, feral ghouls came out of no where, and Motherzhip Zeta strayed incredibly far from the atmosphere of the series
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WOULD a game of the fallout new vegas include gunrunners arsenel and the courirs stash dlc with the four main dlcs and When would it come out as a estimate
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You know Bethesda could have made their own factions that fell into the same category as Brotherhood and the Enclave. For example an established militia descended from the Secret Service(and political survivors of the bombs)- HQ the white house and surrounding area- replacing the enclave example name "The SS", only wants to protect itself(cause their blood-suckin politicians). Branch of the The SS that thought the American government was to blame for the war- HQ Pentagon/ Citadel and surrounding Area-Replaces "D.C. Brotherhood" by trying to rebuild society while also warring with the muties, raiders, ghouls, and The SS-example name "Stratiotes" (derived from the greek word meaning soldiers), follow spartan society with brutal training of men but accept outsiders and protect those in their domain.
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I agree. This could have made the game more plausible and related to Fallout, and it would be much easier to grasp it as canon at the moment.
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SS. Great choice in names. Schutzstaffel -Copy into your Wikipedia search bar.
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Like the Waffen SS? Hitlers shock troops? Ill save you the time.
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When you buy an IP, you kinda want to use the most popular elements of that IP. Otherwise you could just save money and make a different game around the same basic premise thereby saving lumps of cash and being limited by past cannon. I wish people would stop whinging about this. Bethesda did create new factions, but they also re-used elements from the previous games. Don't forget also that the interest created in Supermutants, BOS and the Enclave for players new to the franchise who started out on FO3 has led to a resurgence of interest in the whole series. This is a good thing. Truth is people complaining are those that simply don't want Bethesda's dirty hands on the franchise at all.
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^ true
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Re-use elements.
Cockroaches. Guns. Setting. Mutants. Ants. Deathclaws. Vaults. Similar technology. Radiation.
Something that didn't have to be re-used?
Brotherhood. Enclave. FEV. Harold.
Perhaps I missed out something in that list. But if you want to use the most popular names, then make a game set on the West Coast. Just don't mess with the canon and make the new fanboys look stupid and ignorant when they come in and make their comments.
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@Anon
Originality is good. Ripping off earlier games in the series is bad. They had a carte blanche, they fucked up.
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I loved Fallout 3 and New Vegas, in fact, I'm just a huge fan of the whole franchise, however, I would've liked the endings of both games to have been more... dramatic? In the sense that there should've been more soldiers, more 'BOOMS', 'BANGS' and so on. The Hoover Dam was a great way to end the game, it's just that there wasn't enough soldiers on the front lines, and it would've been so much funner to have as many companions with you as you wish. I don't want to sound judgemental, and I fully trust in Bethesda and Obsidian, but they need to hear the fans feedback so that the next game will be far better than the last and make sure there isn't anything they wish they had put in that they never did. Also, I really would love to see new hairstyles, make-up options and FAR better wardrobe.. HELLO? There's so much inspiration you can take from 1950's in terms of fashion, art, music, showbiz, technology. I know that there's people who play Fallout that don't care about fashion, but wearing leather armour is so boring. There should be more customisation options. It's great to see Tim Cain back, I respect him and his artistic vision very much. Waiting on the edge of my seat for the next installment in the Fallout series. :)
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More dramatic? More booms and bangs? That's not dramatic...
The Vault Dweller's exile was much more dramatic, you know. Especially the part of him walking away into the desert, all wounded and cut, and Maybe playing in the background.
If anything, I hope for a satirical ending (on the protagonist's side), you know, with a joke lying inside it, but obviously not slapstick. More booms and bangs aren't very dramatical, because you don't care for the soldiers that die on the field, you don't even know them.
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Well, the first time I reached the ending of those games I was satisfied. FO3's ending was damaged a little by the foolish design error of not considering that Ghouls and Super Mutants are immune to radiation. With FNV however I simply found that after completing it once and then doing all the DLCs in order as they came out when I finally finished again I was totally detached from it. What that demonstrates to me is that they do need a Broken Steel type DLC to enhance the main games (I don't necessarily mean extending it beyond the standard ending) and bring you back around to the original premise before you finish up. At the minimum having some kind of reference in the final battle to events from DLCs would help to make it more relevant.
As far as having more companions at the end, well I could kind of go with that, though maybe not actually having them as companions. Perhaps some of those that aren't directly with you could be convinced to be involved in some way (Like Arcade). In FNV although the companions have depth and side quests they are heavily unbalanced towards good and ncr supporting characters. If they were to have extra end involvement they would have to be more balanced so that you don't end up with the "good" character having an army with him while the "evil" one ends up on his lonesome.
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@Intro anon: I dont agree with you on any of which you just said. More booms and bangs i believe wouldnt of helped so much. It would only make me mad at the fact i keep crashing. (Note: My computer cant handle that well) Not to mention that doesnt make anything dramatic at all. What was dramatic for me was the companion endings. It reminds you that the wasteland is unforgiving when you hear them.
Also a far better wardrobe? Nu-Uh. This is a post apoctalyptic setting. Im pretty sure that wastelanders have alot more things to worry about then wardrobe. Dont try and match the standards of the game with our modern standards, it just wont work.
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The size of the last battle was mostly due to console limitations and inefficient memory processing of the outdated engine. The only reason there were so many face masks there for instance was to save facegen memory.
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Can we not all agree that fallout 3 brought the franchise to a new larger audience therefore allowing the continuation of what was a dying series of games. Van burren would have been faithful to fallout 1 & 2 but no-one new would have bought it. The new larger audience has allowed the game to expand and become a beloved game to another generation of gamers.
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i agree, fallout 3 started a whole new wave of fans and brought it to the height of awesomeness.
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If you don't like FO3, though, why would should you care if a whole bunch of people are playing it?
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Wait, what? The early 2000s were the Golden Age of RPGs, and considering that Van Buren could have been released in 2003, a lot of people would try it out (you know, before Half-Life 2, Far Cry, and that sort), from simply it being post-apocalyptic to the new outstanding graphical engine.
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What? It was Fallout success that allowed Bethesda to buy iD Software, because people were starving for a continuation of F2 and earned Bethesda a truckload of money. Also, it was because the quality of the first two games that most gamers were excited about FO3, earning another truckload of money in merchandising to Bethesda. Dying frenchise my a**!
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Yet it's interesting how a huge number of people seem to have been introduced to the franchise by FO3. The number of people interested in the franchise has gone up not down due to the game. As for if the franchise was dying or not, it wasn't dying, it was dead. Sure there were still fans, but then there are still fans of a lot of old games, that alone doesn't mean they will be revived. The changes Bethesda made were dramatic and risky and it paid off and enhanced the popularity of all the fallout games. FO3 didn't make the majority of people dislike the franchise, it caused more people to like it. Fallout 3 outsold all the previous games in the franchise PUT TOGETHER. So the idea that this is somehow just Bethesda sucking money out of the games die hard fans that have been waiting around since FO2 for a proper sequel is frankly laughable and anyone that thinks so is deluded. Now all these extra gamers can go back and enjoy the previous games. They also form the main body of players that went on to play FNV. That makes the game the most influential on the continuing existence of the Fallout universe. Some people don't like it and it's not without it's flaws but that doesn't make it a failure or a cynical ploy to take money from the hard core fans of FO1&2. Those people that refuse to accept FO3 did anything positive just make themselves look stupid by ignoring so many obvious facts.
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It's a crying shame it's a temporary contract. I've played Fallout, Arcanum, and Planescape, and I would more than love to see what Chris and Tim could do together. What with Tim's epic world building, and how Chris can expand the concept further pretty damn well.
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I know this is off topic. But I love Arcanum.
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I do too.
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Bloodlines was pretty great too. Anything Troika did, really, shame the end kind of falls apart due to all the troubles that plagued them.
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I am tired of the whole "fallout 3 didn't give the franchise any justice" crap. Why wasn't it like the other fallout games? Because the capital wasteland received very little influence from the west. Therefore it is possible that the capital could have had a different experience than 1,2, and New Vegas.
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^This
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The key word is could have had. Why is there FEV, Enclave and BoS? Just for the kewlness, doesn't even make sense...
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"Little influence from the west"? Dear Anon, did you miss the Enclave and the Brotherood, two western factions, awkwardly shoehorned into the game?
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I don't think he has played Fallout 1 or 2, Tag.
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yeah because no one would be complaining if Bethsoft made a Fallout game with no factions ( from the IP they they have the rights to ) anything from th from the previous . Sure yeah ok, go ahead and lie to yourselves about that. Fallout 3 should have featured just raiders right?
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Lol. That's a very ignorant and stupid thing to say.
As if you can't make up new factions. Fallout 2 invented NCR and Enclave. Van Buren was to introduce Caeasar's Legion. Time to start thinking, anon.
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Fallout 3 should've featured original content, not recycled stuff from Fallout 1 and 2.
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Personaly i prefer the new fallout games, and no i wouldnt say 3 just use recycled content. Thats like saying that any sequel, or most sequels such as fable, halo, final fantasy are all just recycled. I like the idea that the Enclave would try to rebuild in washington and that, given it being the capital of the USA the Brotherhood would see the importance of it too. The story was original BTW
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There were lots of places of more importance to the Brotherhood then D.C., and even though it might have been important there's no sense in sending hundreds of men across the country on a wild goose chase for something they didn't even know existed whilst engulfed in a war they were loosing.
As for the Enclave I could've accepted them if they weren't just there with the exact same plot as in Fallout 2, but with no new motivations what-so-ever except being "hur hur I eez evulz, lol". -
Carter, you don't make sense. Fallout 3 recycled pretty much everything from the original games.
Brotherhood as the protagonist's helper? Tick. Super mutant threat? Tick. Enclave threat? Tick. Water purifying? Tick. GECK for more purifying? Tick.
Fallout 1's and 2's main storylines all in one, nonsencial and non-original crappy adventure, also known as Fallout 3.
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actualy anon im not disputing im just saying a lot of the story is origonal. Also the enclave are doing the same thing as they were in F2 so i agree. i just found it an a more fun game to play. Some people say the story was crap and i can understand why but a lot was original. I just found it had a lot more play value than f1 and 2 but some people will disagree. i just find it funny how one group of people will react strongly to a simple game view. NV is my favourite for gameplay but f2 had the best story i thought, it just got a bit boring after first playthrough.
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I have a hard time imagining that the Enclave would ignore the Washington D.C, as it is the capital of the country that they think belong to them. If I was the Enclave I know I would be interested in, say, the Pentagon for example.
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That was never disputed, Gears. But the fact remains that the Enclave was supposed to be destroyed completely, and the few remnants killed by the NCR. But no, an insufferable number of them appeared out of nowhere and rolled across the country...
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They came from the Adams Air Force Base, I believe.
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Very much doubt they'd be interested in Washington DC. Any high value, top priority databank, design or technology piece wouldn't be stored in such an obvious target as the Pentagon. Furthermore, the Enclave doesn't need DC, they have their own bases hidden across the wastes, along with pre-War maps of the entire North American continent listing military bases, safehouses and whatnot. And while much of it may have gone up with the Oil Rig, I still fail to see any reason for deploying to Washington on the other side of the continent. And no "it's the capital" is not an argument. Capital is just an arbitrarily picked city to store your elected government in, worthless after a war in a land where ignorance is king.
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how is fallout 3 "recycled material" if you want to see recycled material go see fallout new vegas.
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Did you miss the entire thread? It's clearly stated. Only things that FNV really recycled were items due to them having to use Gamebryo.
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^ Atleast New Vegas added some new storyline elements into the series, unlike F3 recycling the orginals.
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If you want to see recycled material, go to your nearest 24/7 store...
How was there any replay value in Fallout 3's storyline, mister? It had no choice at all, so the only thing replayable there was seeing Daddy die, and blindly following the Brotherhood into attacking the Purifier. Fallout 1's storyline could offer you to join the mutants, save the Vault from dying of thirst by sending caravans of water, and much more. As for Fallout 2's story, I'm not exactly aware... nothing that would change the straightforward plot, but I guess I'm not exactly aware.
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Whether or not Beth "recycled" plot points is irrelevant its the execution of said "recycling" that matters and whether they were successful in this aspect is relative and an opinion. What's more is Fallout 3's job was to introduce Fallout to a new audience so they used some elements from past Fallouts to accomplish this goal. Of course whether Fallout should have been aimed at a wider array of people is also debatable.
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To the contrary, it's very relevant. Since Fallout 3 was aimed at a new generation, Bethesda didn't have to recycle old Fallout content, they had a blank slate available to them. But they did regurgigate old content and published it as their own. This reeks of lack of creativity and is a bad practice overall.
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Like I stated Tag, they wanted to introduce the Fallout world to a new generation so they incorporated some elements from the past Fallout series into the game. Using concepts and elements from other works have been a huge practice in history and many of the great works in our literary canon have done the same. It's not where the elements come from it's how you use it but like I said whether or not Bethesda has done this adequately or to what extent is an opinion.
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I didn't necessarily have TOO much of a problem with the Enclave being in DC - there were some (coveiniently placed) FEV facilities within vaults in the area and John Henry Eden, who (though pretty ridiculous) did happen to be a supercomputer who shared their goals / general outlook. I could see them attempting to move there after the rig getting annihilated in Fallout 2, though a bunch of plot elements seemed basically thrown in so that the Enclave had a reason to show up.
As for their size and numbers, that WAS a bit ridiculous. I could get that maybe a few squads were out in Vertibirds and such when the rig fell, but not the apparent army they had in fallout 3.
The brotherhood, on the other hand - I don't really buy that at all. They didn't seem to have Vertibirds like the Enclave did, nor ground vehicles or anything else. How, exactly, did they cross the wasteland then? Did they walk? Why bother?
I don't think it's fair to say Fallout 3 didn't do the series ANY justice, and I am a longtime fan - it did a good job visually capturing the style and had a few side quests / storylines that lived up to the old games. But it certainly IS fair to point out that it is has a pretty paper thin storyline compared to 1 / 2 / NV - though it should be unsurprising to anyone who plays Bethesda games. They can craft a cool little sandbox for you to run around in, but the actual plot of their games is usually pretty bad.
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Now that's the thing, crafting a sandbox is very easy. Slapping the name 'RPG' is also very easy. Actually making an RPG is quite hard.
Speaking of free-roam and sandbox, Far Cry 2 and STALKER (the latter not so much, because the loading times took away from the total immersion) handled it quite good, for shooters.
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f3 is no where near as much of a fuck up as interplays FO:Brotherhood of steel or FO:Tactics and what about all the cancelled games. lets see if they can actually release online before complaining about bethesda. Bethesda - They may be late sometimes, but at least they deliver
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WTf? BoS as partagonists recycled? What were you smoking when you played Fallout 1? They were definitely not the partagonists. If i remember correctly they were Tech whores. They didnt even play a big role in the game. The only thing i see that is re-used with the BoS are the Outcasts personality and the Super mutant-BoS war. But no one complained to Tactics about that did they? (Did they?). Also the BoS sending hundreds of soilders across the country on a wild goose hunt? Now didnt the BoS go half way across the country to defeat any remaining super mutants? Not to mention they pulled an airship out of no where which couldve been helpful against the enclave dont ya think? I know all of that was non-canon but i dont see alot of people saying that game ruined the fallout series (More so they pointed at BoS and Fallout 3). They loved it because of the gameplay and people got butt hurt at Fallout 3 for being an RPG FPS. Also the Enclave are the Old government Tag. Why would they not have interest in spreading propoganda to people of the east coast who havent yet heard of their mid-doings in the west. Sure they dont give a crap about to people, they want the experiments. Also they might've wanted to see the results of their past experiments. They wouldnt have experiments and then not see the results. Also the size number was not at all too big. The enclave arent dumb. If anything they're smarter then the BoS east and west. Before the war they wouldnt have themselves in one small area. No, they would have hundreds of bunkers scattered across the country (Mabye even off the country such as the oil rig) and about the super mutants. Do you really think that its a copy just because they appeared? Because they didnt have the same goals or the same level of intelligence. They werent capturing DC they were destroying it. So before you go off about how they were like the the old ones think.
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I love how moments after i start typing take a break type some more you contradict what i posted. Thanks carter.
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No one gets "butthurt" about Tactics because it's not the new official canon which breaks the old established canon. And as for the Enclave being the old government, that's plain wrong. The Enclave was the "Shadow government" behind the actual government, they were the ones pulling the string and puppeteering the real government, but they weren't the government themselves.
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I like how its a 50:50 split toward supporting interplay or Bethesda games, fact is if the 2 got together and made a single game using a development team from both companies they would probably make an awesome game, but instead people moan at each other on forums like this. I simply dont like the idea of Interplay making more fallouts after the crappy games they released towards the end ( not including F1 and 2 so dot bitch about that). BTW Maleel your welcome im sure your loving these blog wars.
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Maleel, why don't you actually take a moment and read what I say? I didn't say they were protagonists. I said, 'Brotherhood as the protagonist's helper'. Unless you don't see the difference, but then I can't help you.
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No way are Bethesda and Interplay joining. Bethesda's blind pride and Interplay's lack of finances simply won't allow that.
Obsidian would make an awesome game. I just hope they hire some good coders. Tim Cain is one of them.
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All the bull shit aside, Fallout 3 is my favorite game of all time, and any one who says well uhh the game sucks, I'll say "you can just go eat a dick if you don't like it" I mean no body held a gun to your head and made you play the game, if you don't like it, or think it's recycled material so what it if it is it made for a great game and brought the franchise to millions of people who have never even heard of the game, so if you still don't like it you can go fuck off.
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Wow very nice.
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When did they help the partagonist in the original games? All i remember was them allowing you to go search for something thinking you're gonna die. And i think i remember them sending a squad (Not even wearing power armor) to help the vault dweller but im not so sure.
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Responding to yourself?
'All the bullshit aside', I don't have to see ignorance jump from one corner to another. If you like it, fine, just don't bring up made-up arguments that don't make sense.
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They sent, if you managed to get them to, Paladins with the VD to Mariposa. Paladins have power armour. They were also a great source of gear in the first 2 games.
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Yak how about you specify who you're talking to?
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I assume he's talking to the potty mouthed anon above lol
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Yep, I was referring to the anon above you. And yep, Scar just told you everything you ever needed to know.
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First of all spelling words in crazy ways doesn't prove anything. Secondly when you buy an IP you want to use the popular elements of it. Thirdly gamers expect to see certain things in a Fallout game. Fourthly, when your making a game with little basis in reality you have to make allowances for things. Fallout 2 had a crashed Federation shuttle, King Arthur, the gatekeeper and the guardian on the edge of forever. After this, having the BOS on the east coast no longer seems like such a stretch. Finally, when you consider that FO3 outsold all previous FO games put together, you have to accept that most of the people playing the game are new to the franchise. So bringing things back to a feel more like Fallout 1 makes a load of sense. Things feel post apocalyptic again and we get a new introduction to Super Mutants, the Enclave and the BOS. Given that this is the first FO game most of the players have played, doing anything else would have been stupid. People saying they should have done there own thing rather then re-using stuff from the franchise have missed the entire point of owning an IP. I get the impression those people would only be happy if Bethesda didn't make a FO game at all, but because they can't get that they are for some reason just trying to suggest they should be making the game less like Fallout. Look, if you hate Bethesda and don't want them making the game then that is fine. Say it loud, say it proud. But don't come up with bulls**t arguments as to why the game shouldn't have any real resemblance to the past franchise.
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TL;DR but I will just assume this is the same as ever Anon comment and thus say
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Enclave would have no interest in DC, wow just wow....
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@ANon
Don't confuse "resemblance" with "copy-pasting previous games". Furthermore, you're confusing non-canon joke encounters with canon content. Bad form.
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Oh, Sorry for being rude in that case Yak.
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The enclave would have interest in DC. Propoganda ever heard of it? The enclave (at the time) were not yet known on the east coast. So they can go over there have their eyebots do their stuff now experiments can happen after they've won the trust of the people of the capitol wasteland.
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They might have interest in DC, but for them it would be useless to go there. Again, a very long distance (perhaps not enough fuel for vertibirds, danger of extreme radiation, possible crazy AA turrets and people with AA rocket launchers); lack of resources and men; many other military installments/pre-government bases much nearer than DC.
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"And I do like how the game has been extended in many ways, into 3D play, into real-time combat, and into new areas of the world." Fallout 3 did that!
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Except New Vegas actually did it correctly in regards to being in 3D while still being an RPG, while Fallout 3 didn't. Also, to your other comment, that doesn't mean the Capital Wasteland didn't feature factions from the West that shouldn't have been there. Or that it should be THAT vastly different
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You do know what an opinion is, right?
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mmmm F3 wasnt the greatest representation of the Fallout universe, and using the logic you could say that F3 was 90% oblivion, and that oblivion was 90% morrowind...
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Guys, he's obviously a troll.
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Actually, Fallout 3 did almost nothing better, but I see I don't need to defend myself. Thanks everyone else
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^ except revive the entire fallout series, bring about new vegas, and sell millions of copies world wide, you mean
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ummmmmmmm............no
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Fallout 4 will take place in Texas. It will feature a fully voiced protagonist named Branson, there will be a simplified character creation and auto level up. Combat will also be simplified and you will automatically lock on enemies and kill them in a cinematic fashion. All conversation will be done with an intuitive conversation wheel with colorful icons to help you chose the right reply. There will be very little dialogue and lots and lots of scripted action. The enclave will make it's return... again... and it's up to you to stop them once and for all!
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is that true?
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no this isnt true... no way.... no way at all...
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^This. It's satirical of Fallout 3/FOBOS/everything Cain doesn't want an RPG to be
Speaking of which, good interview. Unsurprisingly, I agree with his points
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bull and shit
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We should make the Bushes fit in the game somehow...somewhere in Texas as a target..
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In addition, there will be lots of nukes and you can detonate them! There will be BIG BOOMS and BAMS! Wow! Automatically GOTY, 10/10 on every super honest website there is (GameSpot, IGN, you name 'em).
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Fuck you man, mass effect is a great game
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Words, words my dear... Mass Effect is good, but sure, Bethesda will publish their game later (or earlier, most likely, coming from them), which'll mean it'll attract a horde of mutated kids to play their 'masterpiece'.
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Mass effect is half decent , not great .... conversations are boring , fighting gets boring after about an hour , and strangely , every species speaks perfect english in north american accents ?
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I agree that a lot of dialogue is quite childish, but although fighting is not innovative, it's still some sort of fun.
As for species speaking English, well, if you can create an intergalaxy language for the game that everyone can understand, go ahead.
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I feel bad for the Enclave, they always get annihilated.
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Mass Effect 1 was good (or at least I think so). Mass Effect 2 was good, but it wasn't an RPG
The Enclave only keep getting annihilated because PEOPLE KEEP BRINGING THEM BACK! If we didn't have to fight the zombie Enclave in Fallout 3, they would only have been defeated once
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AARRRRERRGGGGHHHH! ugh... I just had a horrible dream...
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On a side note, I think it would;ve been awesome in NV when you reunite the Enclave Remnants you could fight with them instead of the other groups. I guess it could involve activating the Secruritrons for them.
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Don't think it would make a lot of sense, they're barely a group around here, all hidden in their bunker, and pretty old now, so giving them power would be nonsencial.
There's the eternal fight of balance vs. realism, and every RPG has to face it one day or another.
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Why the obsession with the Enclave? They're dead. They're not coming back. No one of the old Enclave, with the exception of Moreno (maybe) is interested in bringing the return of the Enclave, so it wouldn't really make any kind of sense to include such an ending. It wouldn't work either, unless you made Judah Krieger and his men Saturday cartoon villains. That'd defeat the entire purpose of the quest and their presence.
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Well, I was thinking about the aftermath of the Second Battle of Hoover Dam. Since the NCR is dedicated to eradicating all traces of the Enclave, wouldn't they (The Remnants) be hunted? And then, I figured instead of propping them up to support either the NCR or the Legion, why not give them their own quest line? It's not obsession and it would be hard to implement due to Obsidian being given 2 years to develop NV, I was just thinking it would be a little neat.
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This guy was either smoking crack, or making fun of a certain rpg game.
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Actually Bethesda is really considering doing a Fallout in Seattle WA.
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@Charcoal
Maybe because the Remnants are all 70+ and repentant?
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Alright, I know it was stupid. I was just thinking if there were more quest lines, that could be one of them. It was stupid, but still.
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Dialogue in Mass Effect isnt childish at all. I'd like you to point out where you think it is childish. I do agree about the combat, thought(In mass effect 2 I liked it better in 1). And they don't speak english. Everyone has a translation system(play bring down the sky)
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Why didn't they ask him what he thought of Fallout 3?
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Because lying would be bad, and telling the truth bad as well. It's not really professional to out him in that situation.
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Because you know what his opinion on it is.
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"I really liked Fallout: New Vegas. I thought it was the most Fallout-y of the post-original games, especially humor-wise"
In other words, he thought Fallout 3 was less Fallout-y than New Vegas
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Bull-spit it wasn't as "Fallout-y" as New Vegas. Last I checked Fallout 3 was a post-apocalyptic, survival action RPG (That also won GOTY and over 50 other awards from different reviewers), not a Modern Western like Fallout: New Vegas. I don't favorite either game (My fav is still Fallout 2) but saying Fallout 3 is less Fallout than New Vegas makes about as much sense as finding the "Real" killer for the O.J Simpson trial.
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You mean because New Vegas had a few modern guns that only gun-nuts can actually give official names to (which is why they weren't given the official names in the first place)? Fallout 2 had modern weapons too, you know, and it gave them their actual names. In fact, Fallout 2 was a post-post apocalyptic society, just like New Vegas (Fallout 2 is my favorite in the series also, for the record). And that's where the Fallout series should be at this point; more rebuilt than Fallout 1, but not modern (which is what New Vegas and Fallout 2 are). Fallout 3 set itself 200 years after the Great War, yet the world was more underdeveloped than Fallout 1. How does that make sense? How is that more Fallout-y? How does that follow the logical progression of the series lore? It isn't, and it doesn't
New Vegas was also closer to the original games than Fallout 3 in terms of RPG mechanics, and especially in relevance (given the location, factions present, and overall story) and consistency with the lore (which Fallout 3 failed at). I don't care how many awards Fallout 3 won (which is irrelevant), it's still a canonically inconsistent, watered down shooter with role-playing elements that isn't the true third sequel in any way, shape, or form. And last I checked, Fallout 3 was about finding your dad and then rehashing the plots from Fallout 1 and 2. Surviving in the wasteland was in Fallout 3 just as much as it was in New Vegas. And I think the mastermind behind this series knows what he is talking about
And it's okay to say bullshit
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^The capital of the U.S. got hit harder than anywhere else in the States, which is why society progressed at a much slower rate, and even at the point where in the West people were thriving, the capital was still a warzone with second-gen supermutants, BOS and later on, Enclave. Mr. House basically said that Vegas would have been a giant hole in the ground had he not disabled and destroyed most of the bombs. I think the East would be in just as good condition as the West if it had had House's tech. Fallout 3 could have started a whole new piece of lore, Bethesda made a story in a place untouched in Fallout lore. Both are equally good, while Vegas had a few more features brought back from 1&2.
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have to agree with scarface, no matter what tim cain would have said if its positive or negative towards fallout 3 it would be bad, i remember reading a while back that someone interviewed Chris Avellone and said thanks for saving fallout from bethesda (not in those exact words but close enough) anyways that was un professional of them and Chris had to give them the "political" answer so it did not seem like he was lieing or telling the truth, i know that little part was not relevant but i felt like bringing it up
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Yep, asking those types of questions is just overall not good when you consider your own creation made by another company. Lonesome Courier, if you try out Matt Chat (the latest one), Cain actually gives his opinion on the game (although it's clear that some things he said simply to make things looks neutral).
Stop bringing up your 'post-apocalyptic, survival' crap. That's not what Fallout is about. So obviously, Fallout 3 has little to nothing to do with the franchise.
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@ Anon
The west was hit just as hard as the east, if not worse. If you examine Fallout 1's worldmap, you'd notice that the Orange county in LA was vaporized, leaving behind a new bay on the Californian shoreline. Find something comparable in DC. Yet, the core region developed and was reborn into something powerful, something massive. At the same time, DC did not.
The reasons for this lack of development are not given in the game, nor is any kind of explanation provided. This is a missed opportunity, as rather than shoehorning in the Brotherhood and the Enclave, Bethesda could've made a game focusing on braving the horribly irradiated ruins of DC and the outlying wastelands, where radiation and mutations prevented the creation of permanent settlements, to uncover terrible Old World secrets laying deep within the rad-filled ruins.
But they didn't. Instead, we received a Fallout theme park, with amusements behind every corner. Would it really have hurt, if the Pentagon was not Lost Hills 2, but more in line with the Guardians of the Old Order Citadel from Wasteland?
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The reason the capital wasteland is less developed than the west coast is because it has had super mutants for a longer time , and in greater numbers .. think about it , the west coast super mutants were born from FEV experiments in the 2100 s (not sure of the exact date ) , while Vault 87 was made to test FEV from the start , meaning it had about 70 years of super mutant production before the west coast , thus resulting in the bad condition of the CW ...
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Hmm, mister. Super mutants appeared right after the War, because FEV was released into the atmosphere; hell, even Richard Grey's expedition took far long ago. Also, you don't seem to understand what FEV is. Its results were actually positive, as only radiation could cause super mutants.
In addition, Capital Wasteland's super mutants are just dumb guys with nail boards who have no specific leader, the Unity had a Master with mutants who could easily handle an energy weapon or a big gun, and thus, in big squads, were a much more centralized force, instead of simple wondering packs of two or three.
If anything, they could cause chaos on the West Coast, not the dumb-dumb muties with a group of super kind armor-shining knights chasing after them.
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No , actually they are a post war production , sure there were tests before the war , but they didnt have the same effect as the masters and not the effect of vault 87 either .. ive read up on the FEV as much as i could , and never did it mention The airborne FEV create any Super mutants of any kind ,it simply gave a sort of resistance (theoretically) ... plus , the original tests also caused increased strength , and in some tests intelligence , but only with smaller animals , Monkeys and other guys were simply made stronger , and more aggresive (sorry if my spelling is bad :P ) .. now as for the leaders , i truly cannot explain that , though it is reasonable to assume they retained some degree of intelligence , and that they are looking out for their own (they dont use tactics in battle , but they know how to use the guns , stuff like that :P )
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That's exactly what I was saying. They were made after the Great War, not before.
At least now you see it doesn't make any sense for the Capital Wasteland to be destroyed...
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The supermutants on the East Coast are a nuisance, not a threat. They didn't manage to conquer it for nearly two centuries, they ain't going to conquer it ever.
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Well, yeah, include that to the list of my reasons :)
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The supermutants were basicly the Kings of the CW until the Brotherhood of steel showed up ,they were everywhere in the CW , and even though a few humans remain , that doesnt mean the super mutants werent the more powerful group , thats said by quite a good few people
as for the other guy , Yes they were created after the great war , but only a couple of years after it , since the whole experiment in vault 87 was for FEV
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By kings , i mean in control , not a bunch elvis impersonators :P
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They were never a group. Anything they ever did was setup a few stupidly placed outposts in the ruins of the city, and then quietly wander around. Come on now, did you see how many raiders there were in the Capital Wasteland? Surely the super mutants, if a threat, would not allow such a growth.
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The raiders barely made sense either, they were leaderless and spread out in the same way as the Super mutants. Just rag-tag, leaderless bands.
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Exactly. The game never even explained which Vault they came from... The first one did.
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i like donuts
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To go over a lot of the topics here:
Los Angeles was hit just as hard as DC, but it is a thriving society. It has problems, sure, but it is a society
The super mutants on the West Coast posed a far greater threat. They were intelligent, they were organized, they had the Master to lead them, and they didn't contradict canon (and yes, the appearance of the super mutants in Fallout 3 and Vault 87 didn't make any sense given the lore). They are constrained to only a couple of areas as well. And don't act like the BOS actually did anything, they couldn't even find the super mutant base when it was ON THEIR FRICKING MAP. The Master's Army actually destroyed Necropolis. The Vault 87 super mutants didn't do anything, and certainly aren't close enough to a lot of the larger settlements that they should stunt their growth
Also, super mutants were created by FEV, but the exposure to radiation determined whether or not they would be intelligent or stupid. So theoretically, a bunch of vault dwellers dipped in FEV should produce intelligent super mutants because they had no exposure to the radiation of the world. They were also a post-war creation, as the experiments in Mariposa never verified that humans would become super mutants (so how Vault Tec acquired FEV to test on humans BEFORE the effects of it were tested at Mariposa is a mystery)
And as Scarface stated, the raiders also didn't make any sense. They had no background, were shallow, unorganized, without a central leader, and really weren't that threatening
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There are hundreds of street gangs in the real world, lots of them arent exactly organized , if the raiders were organized , now that wouldnt make sense ..i mean these guys are supposed to be quite stupid compared to most , and you dont need a leader to jump a bunch of wastelanders .. the fact that they all fight together is just Game software limitations , as making loads of different gangs would just be more annoying than helpful , maybe 2 or 3 , that would have been ok ... now on to the super mutants .. on the west coast they had quality and leadership (im not saying they were small in number , just that there werent as many as the east coast) on the east coast they quantity and no apparent leadership .. now as for their ability , a couple of super mutant masters can take on a at least 3 paladins and have a chance at winning , now im not talking about how much of a threat they are to you(the player charecter) but to others , also , the vault 87 guys grow with age , allowing for certain mutants to be tougher than others , meaning that the ones who were pushed back were the older ones , and that the bunch you fight may be a younger group
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Actually , im wasting my time here , we all are really, none of us will ever be convinced by the other , (no offense, but it is the truth , no? )
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Lol, anon. Ignorance in its purest form.
When I said 'organized', I meant any of the Vault 15 raiders - Khans, Jackals or Vipers, and such as Vault 3 (or is it Vault 34?) raiders - those drug junkies. They have some sort of a leader, and while they don't necessarily acknowledge him as that (they can go on their own and raid someone), there's still some sort of rule.
The super mutant quantity don't matter if they're split into groups of three which a few average wastelanders can quickly defeat. Besides, the Master had a huge amount of super mutants - just the Mariposa base has some tens of them, and then the mutants at Necropolis (if they make it there before you help the ghouls out). And if they're all handling actual energy weapons and big guns (the latter is quite rare), and work in an organized force, then they can, I bet, take on a town such as Shady Sands and Junktown.
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Could you stop calling me ignorant ? i didnt insult you , an im not the one who said super mutants were created by the FEV in air ,either :P ,do you even know what ignorance means? ... i understand what you meant when you said organized , ive read about every page on this wiki ... also , when you reach about level 10 , NO wastelanders can beat a squad of 3 brutes , nevermind masters or overlords , so please , go spout your nonesense elsewhere ..
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Great. You haven't moved a step.
Do I have to copy-paste my previous comment? Or should you just read it again, to finally understand what I was telling you?
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I understood what it meant , the raiders have sme form of leadership but are free to break off and loot if they wish , but most of the time there is some control , now if i have misunderstood , which is entirely possible , please correct me ... and the bit about the super mutants was just me telling you that both mariposa mutants and Vault 87 ones could take on a town , as most wastelanders dont stand a chance against them , even the most advanced city in the CW (im not saying its as tough as shady sands or junktown , but its got some firepower) could be overtaken by about 5 super mutant brutes and 3 masters , so yes , they are very much a powerful force
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sorry thats Some*
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There were two factions of "generic" raiders in New Vegas that you fought against (the Jackals and the Vipers), as well as the Great Khans and the Fiends, who were both organized. Street gangs do usually have some form of a leader and do take the time to plan operations. Just labeling a faction as general and large as the "raiders" and then not giving them any sort of leader is nonsensical
As for the super mutants, maybe if the people of the Capital Wasteland weren't idiots and formed "settlements" with only two to five people they'd be alright against the super mutants. But that being said, they are scarcely any super mutants near any of those settlements, and the larger ones are perfectly protected. Furthermore, numbers do not matter if they are an unorganized mess and if they are split into groups of only three with basic weaponry. You may have encountered only three super mutants of the Master's Army in a Fallout 1 random encounter, sure. But they also had powerful weapons. And when it actually came to attacking towns, there were a lot of them. And they were all organized by a superior intellect who knew what he was doing. How do the super mutants on the East Coast even know what to do? They have no commander and they are idiots (they also shouldn't exist but that is a different issue). So no, they shouldn't be that effective, nor able to take down a larger settlement
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I’m writing this in my room at the Palace Hotel in Zagreb, Croatia. Croatia is one of the six republics which used to comprise the Socialist Federal Republic of Yugoslavia. From the end of World War II until the 1980s, Yugoslavia was a successful socialist economy under the leadership of the benevolent and much-beloved dictator Josip Broz Tito (1892-1980), whose birthday is still widely celebrated on May 25 every year. After Tito’s death, Yugoslavia broke up into constituent republics, and Croatia, along with other republics, opted to embrace capitalism and democracy.
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What does this have to do with Fallout? Or anything people will care about?
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its about that shitty argument about deleted comments and dictators and stuff
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The argument is deleted... as I said. Dictatorship
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If any of you would care to check, the comments were deleted in order to move the discussion away from this blog, since arguments about "dictatorship" were derailing the discussion of the blog subject. The deletions and allegations, etc., are being dealt with somewhere less disruptive. Now, please, drop the subject and have fun with the discussion at hand.
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Sorry then...
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i just had a snapple fact today saying something about Croatia O.o
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I was on holiday on the Croatian island of Brac in September I found it fantastic. Croatia is a wonderful country and the people I met were warm and very welcoming i will be going back as i did not get to go to Dubrovnik which looks like a lovely place :)
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There are a lot of fantastic places in Croatia...
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I saw Fallout 1, Fallout 2, and Tactics in a store for 6.99 today. Who wants to guess what I'll be playing for the next year?
That's right. Modern Warfare 3.
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You had me good there...
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Yes and you were probably playing black ops all this year, you may aswell be playing the exact same game over and over again.
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Yeah, you could be a roleplayer!
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Yet again Jolipinator's immense "wit" has managed to make himself look like an ass. Impressive.
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y u guys mad tho?
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dont be hatin, scarface, its bad. By the way, I think its pretty funny
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I picked up a dicebag and DnD 3e player's handbook this year. I can say that those have provided more entertainment than any Call of Duty. If you're going to invest in a online FPS shooter, then the least you can do for yourself is to play Battlefield 3.
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No, invest into Counter Strike instead. Be it 1.6, or Source, both rely on actual skill rather than choice of weapons, perks, or iron sights.
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No, invest into Counter Strike instead. Be it 1.6, or Source, both rely on actual skill rather than choice of weapons, perks, or iron sights.
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Does it matter what game he plays? They are video games, I consider how much I like them by how much fun I have, not by how much skill it takes to play. I like CoD's campaigns, Survival Mode looks fun, and multiplayer's good for when your bored. Counter Strike only has multiplayer mode, so it will get old for me fast. Only games with one mode that can keep my attention for long are games like Bioshock and Fallout that's single player is incredible and fun enough to keep me entertained.
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Yeah, except that it's much more interesting. Anywhere from classic and deathmatch, you can surf, fight against zombies and do a death run with a few players. All the servers are much better than CoD's, because they allow global stats, banking systems, team betting, various game input voices (such as Quake's or quotes from movies) and much, much, much, much more.
And you seem to be forgetting about bots. If you don't want to join a server, you can make your own with bots, set their difficulty level, define their behaviour and even the guns they can actually purchase.
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I agree, Counter Strike is a much more in-depth game. I prefer Source because it's more one shot - one kill type of a game than 1.6, but it's still more fun than Call of Duty. At least tactics and skill is very important in that game.
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Twenty year old dog? Bloody hell.
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I was thinking the same... That's the oldest dog I've ever heard of.
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Most people who would own a dog that old would rather kill him/her with deadly gas. Don't know how did the dog do any functions, like eating or walking outside...
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Or eat him...
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Robodog.
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Or it is really Rex...
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or perhaps... Gabe
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An Australian Cattle Dog (FO3's Dogmeat breed) is in the world records for the oldest dog. Lived to be 29 years old.
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- Ahem* That's the breed of every Dogmeat.
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- ( i really wanted him to be on the imaginary fallout 4 dev team that i came up with in my head
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Odd that he seems to plan on leaving next year.
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Seems a shame. Probably won't get much done in a mere year.
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Of
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i just hope f4 comes soon.
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unlikely, considering Bethseda is releasing Skyrim soon. i would say at least 2 years away.
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well who knows it may be in preduction in secret hope they confirm it at E3 this next year
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i doubt that bethesda only has one project going at any given time. how about you read up on business project managment Anon. it is impractical for any company to focus one one soul project at any given time. thats how companies go broke.
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Yeah, but as one project is prioritised, like Skyrim undoubtedly was, they wouldn't spend that much energy, nor resources, on the "side" project.
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I hope that fallout 4 isnt out until lik 2014-2015. I want a chance to miss it. I dont want a new game every two years. Theyd just get shitty fast
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yes but there are "teams" that work on certian projects. its not the whole company working one one project.
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Nobody is denying that, Xantos. Just that most of the company is working on Skyrim, while a few guys are just preparing the code, some straightfoward art and ideas how to make the game more mainstream and less Fallout.
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Lol at last Anon xD
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Nice interview Will. On a related note, I think the original father behind Fallout should help develop F4, not that other company that made a poor excuse for a sequel to F1/2. A good game, yes. A good sequel, no.
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Maybe not completely true to the aspects that make a sequel, but New vegas I would have to say IS a great sequel, and if Fallout 3 hadn't been made the way it was New vegas would be nothing like what it is....maybe not even exist.
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I suppose everything has a purpose, but one of my main problems with F3 was that it brought back a lot of mutants from the previous games (Super Mutants, Centaurs, Deathclaws, ect.) but didn't have as much as a interesting background, or reason why they appear on both the East and West Coast. Also, I don't understand why the Enclave would want to travel Nation-wide to D.C., but, they did already have a base established there. Oh, and they were made out to be a bunch of evil child-eating monsters. I mean, in F2 they were made out to be pricks, but not as inhuman.
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When were they made out to be pure evil ? i mean i know you should have had the option to join them , but they are never portrayed as evil , they are simply seen as the enemy by the brotherhood of steel (in Fo3 i mean) and not many people complement their enemys much ....
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They're portrayed as evil. They killed your daddy! Oh no!
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You are also given the option to insult and disrespect you father (i know that it didnt make a difference in the main story , but that doesnt mean it isnt there ) thus , you wouldnt hate them too much , plus you can try to help eden , meaning your charecter can be willing to embrace the enclaves ways , though autumn takes over afterwards and doesnt allow that
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Insult the father? Ooh, I'd really love to see that line. Please, give me a screenshot. And if you insulted your father (if!), how would that make you not hate them too much?
And how can you help Eden? By placing FEV in the Potomac? Oh dear, how much choice here! Oh wait... why couldn't I help them out before? And why did I have to help the Brotherhood capture the purifier back when I could insert the FEV for them?
Please, cut the crap.
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I just explained why you help the brotherhood at the end , its you whos refusing to listen Augustus autumn takes over and decides that infecting isnt a good plan , so you either side with the brotherhood to exterminate all the enclave , or you side with them in order to eventually betray them and complete edens plan, there thats why , its not my fault if its not good enough for you ... now on the father topic , why dont you replay the game and see , you can disrespect just as you find him in vault 112 , and also as a child, and also afetr he dies (i already said it has no effect on the main story , but its still there) .. now stop being sarcastic and think before you talk , dipshit
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No, I don't have to replay the game. Your argument isn't worth shit if you don't have any facts to back it up. You're the first person on the Internet to have mentioned it anyways (or one of the first), so you have even less chances of proving it without providing a screenshot.
The Enclave? Why do they keep shooting at me? If I'm willing to help them and later on betray them, then surely they must accept me! But they don't. So please, gain some knowledge. You're fighting the Enclave all the time, being able to insert the FEV or blowing up the Pentagon is just an illusion of choice. It's a major faction, you should be able to help them, but you don't have the chance. Also, from the gibberish you just wrote there, I understood that August is against Eden, well then... Why can't I join August? Or Eden? It just doesn't make sense.
As for the words, watch out. It's not good to call out on people whom you're not intelligent enough to argue with. Right, you're supposed to argue, and provide arguments, not hate-based insult.
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The anon above is correct. I approve of his posttm.
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I gave you proof , you just refused to try and actually see it , all you have to do is start a game and sprint to vault 112 , and see for yourself,or you can probably see it on the iternet , im sorry that i cant post a screenshot but i dont know how ... and im not the first one , im one of many who noticed it unlike you ,and dont insult me and then tell me not to do so to you.. now about autumn , he doesnt trust you , he thinks your a stupid wastelander , eden on the other hand, sees potential , being able to join autumn wouldnt make any sense , and stop calling yourself intelligent , you arent providing any new input on anything, your just repeating the same argument and calling it an answer or an explanation ....
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Facepalm...
Link me a screenshot, or take your camera and take a photo of the dialogue option (unless you're on PC, then use a program such as HyperCam or FRAPS). You know, like in the Bethesda vs. Interplay case, the Bethesda lawyer told the judge to look up the MMO website for evidence, well, guess what? The judge said 'you should have prepared it before you came into this room'. Same thing here. You give me evidence, because it's your argument.
Autumn does not think you're a stupid wastelander. Even if he did, he would be stupid, but the game suggests he isn't (you have just murdered a few highly-trained squads of his army, why can't he use you as a valuable asset?).
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On the PC, it's a matter of hitting PrintScreen.
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Ok i'll simplify a bit , go to Star paladin cross page (this is extremley easy) and there will be something written about insulting your dad , im sorry , but I DO NOT KNOW HOW , repeat , I DO NOT KNOW HOW to link or screenshot , ok ? im sorry , but i dont It seemed to me he didnt trust and thought you shouldnt join , thought you were a bit stupid , perhaps only i saw it , but i'll give you this one because you made your point there :) anyways , i give up , you win lad , im not saying i agree with you , but i cant convince you :P
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Woohoo, one more victory inside our pocket. Thanks, anon. :)
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What could he possibly be working on?
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Another half baked sequel that murders the franchise, what else does Obsidian do?
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ba-dum tsh.
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umm alepov fallout new vegas isnt as bad far series murdering as fallout 3 and yo mama
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Alepov, your whole life is a half baked sequel
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All who stand against Alepov please report to the Regimental Commissar for immediate execution. Clearly this is a Communist Matter.
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Next time if you fuck with Alepov you are gonna end up in a gulag in Siberia!
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Russia might have an incredibly powerful military, but they don't stand a chance against angry Fallout fans.
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Sweet, this is so much fun, lulz lulz lulz :-). This is one of the reasons I like coming here, there is so much good humor, even when some people are hatin badly
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Good humor? Calling out on Russia?
Get a sense of humor, now.
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Hey I would mind seeing a sequel to half-baked xD
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^wouldn't *
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"I really liked Fallout: New Vegas. I thought it was the most Fallout-y of the post-original games, especially humor-wise"=polite way of saying fallout 3 had the weakest story of all fallout games
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/implying your opinion is important to others/true You can't really assume that. He didn't say anything of the sort.
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/impling anyone likes FO3 for the story
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I like how people always call Fallout 3 the worse of the games and claim that it ruined the tone and shit, conveniently forgetting that Brotherhood of Fail ever existed. I mean, come on guys. They didn't even *try* to make it it with that one.
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How does it directly indicate #3 as the weakest? Using your broken logic I could make the same statment about FO2, seeing as he was talking about EVERY game past the original Fallout.
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@The Malignancy: It's not considered a canon Fallout game, and no one takes it as a serious Fallout game to begin with. When you're talking Fallout role playing games, you're referring to Fallout 1, 2, 3 and NV. Not saying that Fallout 3 was a good Fallout game, mind you.
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I liked FO3's story, sure it made no sense in the series but it was still a great game.
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@ The14th
He said post-original games, as in Fallout 1 and 2. But yes, it wasn't implying anything about the story. It was implying that Fallout 3 strayed farther away from the first two than New Vegas, which it did
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I liked fallout 3s story ... and also , it takes place on the east coast , making its story mention Fo1 and 2 wouldnt make any sense ?
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Well, the game already doesn't make sense, by putting many factions and Fallout items into there instead of creating its own. You don't have to reinvent Nuka-Cola, but the Brotherhood, Enclave, FEV? All that is easily replacable.
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If it was replaced , i wouldnt like the story
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Wait, what?! You are not a Fallout fan, nor do you care for the franchise (only Bethesda). Your words are just so extremely ignorant.
Now seriously, why can't you give the Brotherhood and Enclave another name? It's not like they're the actual Brotherhood and Enclave from the original games, so giving them another name would actually make the whole thing sensible.
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Yeah , i dont love the first two , but i like their storys .. though i like fallout 3 a whole lot more , just please dont do the whole [bethesda fanboy] routine and insult my intelligence , i really mean no offense to any of you or you franchise , im just giving my opinion :)
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And my words arent ignorant , they are ....opinionated maybe ? ignorance means a lack of information or understanding in a certain subject , and im not , i think i know my fallout history well enough , i mean i read it from here :P
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It is ignorant. If there were replaced, I wouldn't like the story. So you like the story because of the factions (which you can replace and rename)? Wow, and then you say how good Fallout 3's story is, it just doesn't meet each other, that's ignorant, mate.
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Ignorance : the conditio of being uninformed or eneducated. lack of knowledge or information ... so , uh , no thats not ignorance , sorry ... now look, i said first ,that i like the story and that they shouldnt mention Fo1 and 2 too much , you said that it didnt make sense cause of the enclave and brotherhood and that they should be removed , and i said i wouldnt like it if that happened , i believe you misunderstood me when i said they they shouldnt mention Fo1 or 2 too much and perhaps i misunderstood you too, but what i meant was the towns and events the happened in the first two , though the brotherhood is known to be spread out , and it would sense (to me at least) that they be their , also the enclave wouldnt have a base on the west coast and leave it unnocupied (sorry for my english :P ) so the others going there means they were likely there as well , but only had around 100-200 guys , then the escaped guys got there,so them being there also makes sense to me .. anyways , i mean no offense and hope you arent offended by what i say , im just trying to have a peaceful disscusion here :)
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That is ignorance, mister. You took your time to actually look it up in a dictionary, but none whatsoever to prepare a nice answer?
The Brotherhood and the Enclave aren't spread out. One started at the Mariposa, the other at the Oil Rig - they didn't have to travel the whole continent. They've been defeated, brutally murdered and executed - but they find the numbers to travel to DC? Hell, no... Especially the Brotherhood.
That said, does it suggest if they were removed/replaced, you wouldn't like it cause you like the name 'Brotherhood' and 'Enclave'? What?! That doesn't make any sense. It's not like you can't make up a new faction, besides, once again, the Brotherhood and Enclave aren't what they actually were in the original games, because they have new rules and are pure good and pure evil instead of being simply bad (both of them), so giving them a new name would actually be better and would have made more sense.
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I'm going to ask Porter for a "Tagz approves of this post" shell extension for comments :P
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The enclave were present since before the great war , they had a lot of influence and are bound to have a few bases After the war , since Eden was already IN raven rock (i cant imagine they would Tug about a massive Supercomputer) its also fairly reasonable to assume they had troops there too , and it has also been 30 years since their oil rig blew up , i thinki ts possible for them to get from one place to the other (or even just to a closer base near the west coast , and , if in demand , the east coast) the brotherhood IS spread out , it has a couple of chapters in different places , and eventually the well will run dry and no more rare tech will be there , so they send a small group east to see what they can get (and it is perfectly reasonable that they used vehicles , cars , trucks , or even walked ) when i said i didnt want mention of fallout 1 or 2 , I meant important events on the west coast and towns there and such ... Now , if they were removed , the story would change , and they would have to remove guys like the outcasts , whom i liked , elder lyons , whom i also liked ,john henry eden , whom i also liked, and thus , i would not . like . the game.... it makes perfect sense
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I'll continue for the anon.
The Enclave are a faction after the War. Even if the US built Raven Rock and installed Eden into there as a mad AI of some sort, Bethesda has stated themselves (and thus wracked the canon) that some Mr. Autumn, along with a squad of Enclave troopers, moved out East. Doesn't make sense. They had a load of places to go, including Chicago (which makes more sense and is the actual canon), but not DC, even if they had a base installed there (why not move out to another Pre-War US base, they have a large and bright interactive map anyways).
The Brotherhood didn't have to move to DC. They could move up north (where they was no NCR, no Legion, no other faction that could propose danger to them) because it was near the Canadian border and thus it is possible a lot of military installments could be there (even not because of the border, but of the Alaskian pipeline), as set in my Fallout 4 idea. Lots of technology, maybe Power Armor, weapons, ammo, uncivilized tribals/small towns that are unable to threat them. Pretty much everything the Brotherhood would want.
First of all, they didn't have to remove the Outcasts. If the Brotherhood would be called 'The Military', then they would be 'The Military Outcasts'. Elder Lyons could be called General Lyons, but he would still be Lyons. Same goes for every single character you meet in the game, including the amusingly stupid Liberty Prime.
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maybe he is working on fallout 4?!?!??!?!?!??!?!?!?!?
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Maybe he fights crime dressed as a giant rat.
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maybe......just maybe............
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Maybe hes a criminal who steals giant ants
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Maybe he has two personalities. One is a crime-fighting giant rat, and one is a giant rat criminal. And he has to face himself as the final boss and main protagonist of... FALLOUT 4: RISE OF THE GIANT RATS.
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Heavyweaponsguy: maybe *sniff* maybe
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Maybe you'll sit and sigh wishing that I were there. Maybe you'll ask me to come back again and maybe I'll say maybe.
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@PUKEBOT I laughed so hard I cried. :P
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So he probably won't stay at Obsidian then :< Well that was disappointing.
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It might depend on wether or not they're going to be working on anything in the near-future.
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If the dog was living in Bosnia, there is a greater chance that he would end up as a meal
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That is rather interesting
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Your point being?
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dogmeat
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heh
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OM NOM NOM
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Damn! 20? thats very old.
